Author: Michael F. Bowman
Company: Attorney at Law

SCOUTS-L
----------
EAGLE PROJECTS

Date: Fri, 29 Jul 1994 22:40:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@cap.gwu.edu>
Subject: Re: Eagle Service Project
To: Charles Nusbaum <aa904@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>

Charles,

Your willingness to spring back from dissapointment is heartening!  Many
old-timers could take a lesson . . .

Anyway, are there any retirement centers close to where you live,
particularly religious or government subsidized?  If so, see whether any
of them have garden plots for residents.  Many are using gardening as an
activity to residents because of its theraphy value and because its just
plain fun.  If these two questions are answered in the affirmative, then
see whether they could use a garden shed to store tools, seeds, etc. 
We've had a couple successful Eagle projects where the candidate organized
the construction of the shed, stocked it with tools and provisioned it
with seeds in metal storage containers.  Hardware and garden center stores
were very willing to donate to the cause.  Lumber came from construction
site left overs.  In all the cost was minimal and the joy immeasurable for
many folks confined to the homes.  Leadership opportunities in planning,
coordinating and carrying out the projects abounded.

Yours in Scouting, Michael F. Bowman, a/k/a Professor Beaver
Deputy District Commissioner Exploring, GW Dist., NCAC, BSA
Speaking only for myself, but with Scouting Spirit . . .
		____ mfbowman@CAP.GWU.EDU ____

Date: Sat, 30 Jul 1994 07:28:35 -0400
From: mhorowit@cap.gwu.edu (Michael C. Horowitz)
To: mfbowman
Subject: Good idea!

Nice Eagle Project suggestion! Mike

Date: Sat, 30 Jul 1994 10:55:29 -0400
From: aa904@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Charles Nusbaum)
To: mfbowman@cap.gwu.edu
Subject: Re: Eagle Service Project

Michael,

	Great idea! 

		--> Charles Nusbaum

--
 Charles Nusbaum              *   Saint Ignatius High School - Class of 1998
 aa904@po.cwru.edu	      * Saint Ignatius Wildcat Marching & Concert Band
 Co-Sysop of The SeaQuest SIG *       B.S.A. Troop 176 - Cleveland, Ohio   
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ *   Order of the Arrow - Cuyahoga Lodge No. 17

Date: Tue, 4 Oct 1994 23:13:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@cap.gwu.edu>
Subject: Re: Eagle Projects - New Question

Bob,

I've also seen a wide range of time on Eagle projects.  In part this is
due to the varying degree of leadership development the Scout has when the
project is initiated.  We've had to encourage more focus and reduced hours
once as well as encourage a bit more initiative.  I'd hate to see a real
number become a target.  I think that it should be whatever is appropriate
to the Scout's skills, talents and capailities, provided he is being
challenged and has to stretch a bit.  I agree with you that his time
management is his responsibility and he should have learned something
about this if he earned the Personal Managment merit badge (requirement
#5) or the Family Life merit badge.  Probably his dad hasn't bothered to
ask what will help him more 20 years from now - grades or leadership
ability.  Sounds like you're doing good Scouting and as usual parents are
more difficult to deal with than the Scouts.

Yours in Scouting, Michael F. Bowman, a/k/a Professor Beaver
Deputy District Commissioner Exploring, GW Dist., NCAC, BSA
Speaking only for myself, but with Scouting Spirit . . .
		____ mfbowman@CAP.GWU.EDU ____

Date:         Mon, 13 Nov 1995 01:04:51 -0600
From: golden cliff <c60clg1@CORN.CSO.NIU.EDU>
Subject:      Re: EAGLE SERVICE PROJECTS
 
These are a few ideas from some past projects my Scouts have done.

- Design and build educational games for learning disabled students.
- Straighten grave markers and fill-in pot holes in road at County Cemetary.
- Set up Disaster Response Plan with local ARC and Scouting, do mock event.
- Design and build historical display for local museum.
- Do landscaping project for local park.
- Build patio area for local nursing home.
- Plant trees for forest preserve district.
- Landscaping project for church.
- Dinner welcoming international students at university.
- Clean up and painting project for church.
- Clean up city parking lots after winter snow melt.
- Set up historical trail through town and write brochure.
- Paint 100 picnic tables for park district.
- Transplant large trees at forest preserve.
- Blood Drive.
- Design, build, and install flag holders for light posts for city.
- Restoration work for native prairie at forest preserve.
- Clean and paint light booth at local high school.
- Work with mentally handicapped students through custom designed porgram.
- Correct water erosion problem at public park.
- Create and implement program to record church services and
     deliver to shut ins.
- Paint house and garage of elderly woman.
- Design & build conservation education unit for forest preserve.
- Build handicapped trail with posts for braille plaques at forest preserve.
- Organize and conduct river clean up campaign.
- Clean up and repair children's playground.
- Rehab old bikes to donate to underprivalaged children.
- Food Drive for the needy.
- Repaint World War II army tank (local monument)
- Build nesting platforms for Canadian Geese for forest preserve.
- Grade pond banks to control erosion, map pond, stock with fish.
- Landscaping project for local VFW grounds.
- Oak savannah restoration project at local forest preserve.

There are hundreds of ideas out there.  I hope these few help.

YIS, Cliff Golden              DeKalb, Illinois
     Scoutmaster Troop 33      cgolden@niu.edu

From mfbowman@CapAccess.org Thu Dec 21 01:01:41 1995
Subject: GOOD NEWS DEPT - Eagle In the Spotlight
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91-FP.951221004934.28087E-100000@cap1.capaccess.org>

The following is taken from the December 1995 edition of GOVERNMENT 
EXECUTIVE a magazine that is sent to most federal Government managers and 
national in its audience:

Jeremy Nuanes, a 17-year-old Boy Scout from Golden, Colo., wants to 
attain the Scouts' highest honor, the rank of Eagle Scout.  And he wants 
to do it by honoring federal employees.

For his Eagle Scout public-service project, Nuanes is raising funds to 
erect a memorial at the Denver Federal Center to all federal employees 
who have lost their lives in service to their country, such as those who 
were killed in last April's Oklahoma City bombing, died fighting fires on 
federal lands, or gave their lives providing disaster relief both here 
and abroad.

Nuanes says he got the idea after seeing the dedication last July of a 
bronze statute and memorial on Colorado's Storm King Mountain to the 14 
fire-fighters who lost their lives in a 1994 blaze there.  "I thought it 
was great, but they didn't recognize all the federal workers that give 
their lives," he says.

Nuanes commissioned Jo Cipri, a sculptor and firefighter, to design the 
memorial.  It will feature a statute of an eagle, representing the 
federal work force, soaring above a globe wrapped in the American flag.  
Nuanes hopes to hold the dedication of the statue during Public Service 
Recognition Week next May.

Nuanes comes from a public-service family.  His father is a firefighter 
and his mother works as a GS-11 engineer at the Bureau of Reclamation.  
But he says his future lies in the private sector. "I want to work for a 
company like IBM and work on computers," he says. "I love computers.  
It's, like, my whole life."

Nuanes is soliciting donations through January 15, 1996.  By late October 
he had raised about $1,000 of the $24,000 needed to erect the monument.  
Contributors donating $2,50 or more will receive a bronze model of the 
sculpture.  Donations can be sent to the Credit Union of Denver, Eagle 
Project Memorial Fund, Attn:  Marcene Walker, P.O. Box 261420, Lakewood, 
CO 80226-1420.

_______________ end story ______________________

Well it may not be Time magazine yet, but anytime an Eagle Scout gets 
National attention in any of the news media in a positive fashion, I 
think its worth repeating.  My hat is off to Life Scout Jeremy Nuanes!

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

Date:         Fri, 22 Dec 1995 14:22:52 -0500
From: "Bruce E. Cobern" <bec@PIPELINE.COM>
Subject:      Re: GOOD NEWS DEPT - Additional Info

On Dec 22, 1995 01:20:00, '"Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@CAPACCESS.ORG>'
wrote:

>Of course an Eagle Project that is solely oriented towards fund raising
would
>not meet the requirements.  Unfortunately all we have is a news article
written
>by someone impressed by Scouting for the rest of the world and not for
those
>who'd ask more questions.  Before we end up with misplaced or unwarranted

>criticism, maybe I can help out.

Since I was one of a couple who raised the question, let me express my
feelings and reservations.
You are correct, we do not have all of the information, so we need to deal
with this hypothetically.  I feel that this is of general concern because
these are issues that many of us face when dealing with Eagle projects.

IF the project involved all of the things you described in the rest of your
post (which I have deleted to save bandwidth) I.E. the Scout was
responsible for the design of the monument, securing permission for its
placement, commissioning the sculptor, having it cast and then sited IN
ADDITION TO raising the considerable amount of funds necessary for all of
this then I would agree with you that this is PROBABLY an acceptable Eagle
Project.  It would also be a MONUMENTAL (pun intended) undertaking, far
greater than what most of the Eagles I have dealt with have done.

If, on the other hand, the Scouts role in seeing this to fruition is the
raising of funds to pay for a project the remainder of the details of which
were handled by someone else, and into which he had minimal or no input or
responsibility, then I would definitely not approve it as an Eagle project.

Even if the first scenario is the case I might still have problems with the
size of the fundraising effort in relation to the rest of the project.  My
interpretation of the fundraising restriction is that national envisions
that fundraising will be incidental to the primary objective of a project.
I do not know at what point the level of fundraising becomes a potential
problem but I tend to believe that I would know it when I see it.  If it
turns out, for example, that 80% of the Scouts time on the project was
actually spent in raising the funds while the rest of the work went on
without major involvement on his part then I would have a problem.

Again, since we do not know exactly what parts of this project are actually
being "planned, led, and given leadership" by this Scout we cannot form any
sort of judgement on its worthiness, other than to raise the red flags and
ask questions.

--
Bruce E. Cobern
Advancement Chairman
Dan Beard District
Queens Council, NY

Date:         Thu, 21 Dec 1995 22:08:33 -0700
From: "Chris Haggerty, Sierra Vista,              Arizona" <CHAGGERTY@BPA.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: GOOD NEWS DEPT - Eagle In the Spotlight

I just sent the following on to the address given in the article quoted by
Michael Bowman.  From the information presented in the article, it is too
difficult to tell if the project is really building the memorial or if the
project is the fund raiser.  As I state in the letter, (with appoligies to
Michael Bowman who works in the press), this may be just another case of
the press twisting things so they write (read) better, but not necessary
correct.  Just in case this is a fund raiser, as the article states it is,
then Jeremy needs to be made aware of this.  He either did not read the
instructions or one of us adults is screwing up again and telling him, his
project is ok when it is not.  In my opinion, if he is not envolved in the
process (more than commissioning) of building the memorial by directing
the effort and coordinating the effort, then this is not an Eagle Scout
Service Project.  Either way, it is still a super thing to do!

                                       December 22, 1995

Credit Union of Denver
Eagle Project Memorial Fund
Attn: Marcene Walker
P.O. Box 261420
Lakewood, Colorado  80226-1420

Dear Ms. Walker:  Please forward this letter to the Jeremy Nuanes, Thank
you.

Dear Master Nuanes:

Please do not take this the wrong way.  My hope is that the GOVERNMENT
EXECUTIVE magazine has not properly presented your Eagle Scout Project.
It is hard to make a judgement when one does not have all the information.
Since I rarely believe exactly what the press states, I hope that this
presentation of your project is not correct.  I am referring to a recent
article published in the December 1995 issue which talks about your Eagle
Scout project.  A copy of what I received is enclosed for your reference.

My concern is that your Eagle Scout project, may in fact be a fund-raising
activity which is not allowed by the rules and policies of the Boy Scouts
of America.  The requirements for Eagle specify that you must use the
"Life to Eagle Packet" BSA # 18-927 while working on your Eagle Scout
Project.  In this document it states on page 0 (the page before page 1):
"The project also may not be performed for a business, be of a commercial
nature, or be a fund-raiser.  (Fund-raising is permitted only for securing
materials for supplies needed to carry out your project.)"  This
information is presented under the Limitations section of this packet.
The "Advancement Policies and Procedures Committee Guide", BSA # 33088,
provides the same information on page 15.  This is the guide used by the
District and Council Scouters to help them follow BSA's National policy.

It is my hope that your real project is building the memorial you are
having designed by Jo Cipri.  It is my hope that the GOVERNMENT EXECUTIVE
should have described your project as building this memorial and that you
are seeking donations for the purchase of the materials needed to
construct the memorial.  That is within the guidelines.

If you have concerns about your project after reading this, please discuss
this with your District or Council Advancement Chairman.  You do not need
to reply to me about this letter.  I am only expressing a concern that
some adults may have missed this when reviewing your project.  These
policies on the requirements for Eagle are not something the local Scout
Executive or anyone, other than the National Committee, can alter.  My
main concern is the possibility that this is a fund-raiser and when you
get to your Eagle Scout Board of Review, someone is going to notice that
and say, sorry your project was not within the Guidelines set by National.
This has happened in the past and the Eagle Candidates involved can be
very demoralized as a result.  While the work was very admirable, it was
not within the guidelines and thus does not count for Eagle.  I would hate
for that to happen to you.

Good luck with your Eagle, from the publicity you have been able to stir
up, there certainly is the potential for you be a very good Eagle Scout.
Like Michael Bowman, I take my hat off to you for what you are doing.
Eagle project or not, this is an outstanding effort.

                                       Yours in Scouting,

                                       Chris Haggerty
                                       Cochise District Advancement Chairman

From mfbowman@CapAccess.org Fri Dec 22 01:20:01 1995
Subject: Re: GOOD NEWS DEPT - Additional Info

Of course an Eagle Project that is soley oriented towards fund raising 
would not meet the requirements.  Unfortunately all we have is a news 
article written by someone impressed by Scouting for the rest of the 
world and not for those who'd ask more questions.  Before we end up with
misplaced or unwarranted criticsim, maybe I can help out.

The project from all that I can understand of it would certainly fall 
within the Eagle Project Guidelines that I know and should receive a 
favorable Eagle BOR as well.  Let me explain in some detail my reasoning:

In evaluating an Eagle Scout Project the BSA Advancement Policies and 
Procedures Committee Guide (1995) states "Fund-raising is permitted only 
for securing materials or supplies needed to carry out the project."

Before a project can be approved, the candidate must identify 
fund-raising, materials to be used, and how the materials are to be
acquired.

  This particular project is a large monument constructed from stone and
  bronze.  From what I have read about local momuments of similar size (and
  I am guessing based on the artist's sketch that was with the article), the
  raw materials alone could easily exceed the $24,000 that Nuanes is raising.
  Add to this the construction materials needed to crate and move the 
  monument from the sculptors studio, etc. and you can see my point that
  it could be that he's getting a bargain on materials.  Unfortunately,
  we have to trust this Scout, because the news story doesn't tell anything
  about its costs - wasn't an audit report you know. :-)

The same Advancement Policies and Procedures Committee Guide suggests the 
following questions for an Eagle Board of Review:

*  Did the candidate demonstrate leadership of others?

   Going throught the process to obtain federal land use permits, organizing
   material acquisition, organizing fundraising, securing the presumably 
   free services of a volunteer sculptor, etc., and bring it all together
   probably should suffice here.  There is nothing that says the Scout can't
   supervise other adults.  Again we have no information to infer he did not
   meet leadership requirements or use other Scouts as well.  

*  Did he indeed direct the project rather than do all of the work himself?

   Same as previous.  The article focuses on the result and I'm prone to
   trust a Scout until proven otherwise.  To me it is obvious that he is
   not doing all the work himself and that he has shown leadership.

*  Was the project of real value to the religious institution, school, or
   community group?

   My :-) guess is that the federal community thinks this is of real value.

*  Who from the group benefiting from the project may be contacted to verify
   the value of the project?

   The same Government that approved the use of federal property for the
   monument.

*  Did the project follow the approved plan or were modifications needed 
   to bring it to its completion.

   Here we have no information, but it looks like the plan is working so far.

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

From mfbowman@CapAccess.org Fri Dec 22 14:38:20 1995
Subject: Re: GOOD NEWS DEPT - Additional Info

Bruce,

I can certainly understand your concerns - you have valid questions.  
Whenever we are reviewing an Eagle Project we should be looking to make 
sure that the acquisition of material or the means to pay for it is not 
the largest part of the effort.  In this case I will hope that it is not.

Chris,

:-) I have been called worse; e.g. a member of the press.  Just to clear 
the record here, I am not a member of the press or any news media.  I am 
a federal Government attorney.  Likewise, I am acutely aware that the 
news media can leave a bit to be desired in writing a story.  For example,
when I was presented my Eagle Scout rank, the local paper ran a short 
story with a picture - the caption was "Wins Birdie."  28 years later and 
I haven't forgotten that little lesson. :-)  I suspect that in this case 
the news story was only a small part of the real story and that much of 
the real effort escaped the writer's pen.

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

From mfbowman@CapAccess.org Sat Dec 23 00:22:10 1995
To: pfarnham@CapAccess.org
Subject: Re: Good News

Pete,

Thank you for your kind understanding of a difficult situation that 
really floored me and put my spirit to the test with temptation to follow 
the darker path with a violation of my own rule of praise in public and 
criticize in private.  At the moment when most sorely tempted, the 
angelic voices of a boys choir penetrated my thick skull and made me 
realize with shame the message of goodwill was one I was about to 
violate. Hence my milder postings in response.  Sometimes it seems that 
God has a way of letting one know when things are going too far, if 
hearing is not impaired. :-)  

While I have bit my lip (bleeding profusely) and was tempted, I found it 
much better to step back for a broader panorama of distance and time to 
place things in a better context.  Chris, who I know and have spent many 
hours with by telephone is basically good at heart, but short in thinking 
before acting sometimes.  To really give him a good public chastizing 
would only make things worse and impair our ability to nudge both him and 
others along to better courses of future action.

My thinking is that it would be better to give young Mr. Nauntes a chance 
to share his work with us and learn more about it.  The facts can speak 
for themselves.  Object lessons will teach themselves.

Thanks for your kind invitation to help.  To the extent that I can find a 
bit more time, I'll be happy to help.  Our trial is over and we are now 
preparing for an appeal after the Judge cut us off without allowing 
critical evidence.  In a month I'll be better able to give an honest 
assessment of how much I can do to help.

Tommorrow I'll be setting pen to paper to write some Silver Beaver 
nominations.  Funny how things change.  Only a few years back I would not 
have thought from my station to have presumed to suggest these awards.  
Now I'm hopeful that those who wear the blue and white will act on the 
words of one who does not and reward some really deserving folks who have 
heart and soul in doing all they can for our youth.  Wish me luck in the 
writing process.

Thanks again for all of your kind words and thoughts.  May God grant you 
and your family a very warm, memorable, and Merry Christmas.  Peace and 
goodwill be with you.

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

Date:         Tue, 16 Jan 1996 17:27:16 -0500
From: Randy Ritter <CCCEF.RRITTER@CAPITAL.GE.COM>
Subject:      Winter Eagle Projects

     Currently have 17 life scouts in the troop and the following projects
     are in various stages of completion:

     Winter Projects:
        Organizing, promoting and running a potluck dinner featuring a
          keynote speaker for victims of domestic violence.
        Creating heath related surveys, polling the community and arranging
           for public forums to discuss the top 6 health concerns.
        Building Bluebird boxes and installing in Spring

     Early Spring projects:
        Island cleanup for creation of badly needed soccer fields.
        Landscaping project at softball field including erosion barriers,
                and creating a tiered spectator area.
        Improving and creating town forest nature identification trails.
        Beautifying a highway exit ramp with shrubery and Welcome sign.
        Coordinating a Good Friday community cleanup day
        Creating a riverside passive use park with bench and picnic table.
        Reclaim & beautify neighborhood walkway between two streets.

     Other winter/early spring projects that have been done are:
        Easter Dinner for the homeless
        Vial for life distribution
        Winter jacket collection, cleaning and distribution
        Recording books for the blind

     Of course the best Eagle Projects are usually those conceived by
        the scouts themselves. However sharing a list of projects may
        be what it takes to get their creative juices flowing.
     -------------------------------------------------------------------
     YIS,  Randy Ritter, Eagle '82 & Scoutmaster Trp 3 Derby, Connecticut

Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 02:14:12 -0500 (EST)
From: "Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@CapAccess.org>
To: Fred Rogers <fredrogers@VNET.IBM.COM>
Subject: Re: GOOD NEWS DEPT - Eagle In the Spotlight

Fred,

Did you read the subsequent messages concerning what we do know and what 
we do not know from the article.  We for example do not know how active 
the Scout is in raising the money or whether he has delegated.  We do not 
know in proportion to the material costs whether it is reasonable, 
although my best information is that the amount is reasonable.  You must 
certainly know that news media no matter how well intentioned do not 
report all the news and most of what you really would like to know.  

The national recognition of something good for a change struck me as 
worth encouragement.  The only response I got for the effort was a good 
lot of grousing from half-informed folks that should know better.  If I 
were the editor and got this kind of a response, I wouldn't make the same 
mistake twice.  To cap it off one of our number decided to write a letter 
to the Eagle questioning his project, which undoubtedly went through his 
own District's review.  

I've had a lot of respect for your thoughts in the past and since I now 
find us a bit at odds on this, please help me understand why it is that 
what should be good news has served only as a place for pigeon poop.  I 
guess I'm amazed at how fast people went off the mark to shoot it down 
without enough facts to know what the target was.  In the hunting safety 
course we'd still call it a homicide, even if the shooter thought it was 
a deer. :-)

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

From mfbowman@CapAccess.org Sat Feb 17 16:27:50 1996
Date: Sat, 17 Feb 1996 16:27:49 -0500 (EST)
From: "Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@CapAccess.org>
To: 
    Multiple Recipients of the List SCOUTS-L <SCOUTS-L%TCUBVM.BITNET@PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU>
Subject: Re: Eagle Project Fundraisers 
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91-FP.960217162709.16050A-100000@cap1.capaccess.org>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Ralph,

There are several reasons for not wanting Eagle projects to involve 
fundraising:

1.  It could operate to the detriment of the Council's own fundraising 
efforts to cover the costs of operation and capital expenses such as camp 
buildings, etc.

2.  Fundraising by the youth could cause a number of intereting tax 
problems for the youth (and/or his family) and the donor unless the youth 
was willing to do what is necessary to become a tax-exempt non-profit 
entity under the tax laws.

3.  The idea of the Eagle Project is to teach leadership.  Fundraising 
can involve leadership, but more often than not would either end up being 
handled by an adult or a youth soliciting contributions instead of 
exercising real leadership.

4.  Fundraising is transitory.  It is hard to see concrete results or to 
know for sure just how the funds were actually used; e.g. were 80% spent 
on administering the charity and 20% used for charitable purposes?  No it 
is much better for the Scout to have done something that he will remember 
and be able to look back upon with pride in his accomplishment.  I can 
still remember my Uncle taking me to Camp Beltzer in Indianapolis in 1965 
and proudly pointing out a brick walkway and retaining wall leading to 
the Dining hall that he had built for his Eagle Project in 1920, 
Forty-five years earlier.  To his death a few years ago he treasured the 
memory of making that walkway that thousands upon thousands of Scouts 
used at camp over the course of some 60 summers.

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 12:22:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@CapAccess.org>
To: SCOUTS-L - Youth Groups Discussion List <SCOUTS-L@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>
cc: Multiple recipients of list SCOUTS-L <SCOUTS-L@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Eagle project question.

Jim,

Planning an Eagle project can be a real challenge.  Before your son gets 
to far down the path of planning his project, he should carefully read 
BSA's "Life to Eagle Packet" No. 18-927 (1995).  In the "Packet" he will 
find that "Working involving council property or other BSA activities is 
not permitted. The project also may not be peformed for a business, be of 
a commercial nature, or be a fundraiser. (Fundraising is permitted only 
for securing materials or supplies needed to carry out your project.)"

Based on what the "Packet" instructions say, organizing a fundraising run 
to benefit the local Council, while praiseworthy, would not be acceptable 
as an Eagle project.  However, he is on the right track.  Perhaps a bit 
of a shift in emphasis could help.  For example, he could demonstrate 
leadership and service by providing all of the support services for a 
run promoting physical fitness among school aged youth where no 
fundraising was taking place.  He could also organize an run bicycle 
safety campaign and trek or even one for skateboarding, where he 
developed a safety campaign in advance of the event, held equipment 
safety tests, had skill tests, and a written test for participants. 
Though not exactly the same, many of his ideas could be carried over to a 
productive project.  Another idea would be to organize a fitness walk for 
seniors in a park with an aid station, free blood pressure tests, 
refreshments along the way, and booths to visit along the route with 
health care people to provide information on health subjects.
Or how about having design a wheelchair accessable fitness route from a 
local hospital or veterans home, correcting problem areas and then having 
an event to celebrate its opening and use.  

Whatever he decides, and it sounds like he is ambitious enough to do 
some really great things, make sure that you work with your District's 
public relations Scouter to see that the local media gets invited to 
attend whatever event or activity he comes up with after a bit more 
planning.  Some of these make great human interest stories and why not 
have his efforts recognized in the community?  

Good luck,

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

Date: Sun, 2 Jun 1996 00:35:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michael F. Bowman" <mfbowman@CapAccess.org>
To: SCOUTS-L - Youth Groups Discussion List <SCOUTS-L@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>
cc: Multiple recipients of list SCOUTS-L <SCOUTS-L@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Eagle Project Ideas-Music

John,

Your Scout's heart is in the right place, but as other posters have 
noted, fundraising is not an appropriate Eagle Scout project.  It may 
help to have some reasons to explain to your Eagle why another project 
would be better and then go over the rules.

There are several reasons for not wanting Eagle projects to involve 
fundraising:

1.  It could operate to the detriment of the Council's own fundraising 
efforts to cover the costs of operation and capital expenses such as camp 
buildings, etc.

2.  Fundraising by the youth could cause a number of intereting tax 
problems for the youth (and/or his family) and the donor unless the youth 
was willing to do what is necessary to become a tax-exempt non-profit 
entity under the tax laws.

3.  The idea of the Eagle Project is to teach leadership.  Fundraising 
can involve leadership, but more often than not would either end up being 
handled by an adult or a youth soliciting contributions instead of 
exercising real leadership.

4.  Fundraising is transitory.  It is hard to see concrete results or to 
know for sure just how the funds were actually used; e.g. were 80% spent 
on administering the charity and 20% used for charitable purposes?  No it 
is much better for the Scout to have done something that he will remember 
and be able to look back upon with pride in his accomplishment.  I can 
still remember my Uncle taking me to Camp Beltzer in Indianapolis in 1965 
and proudly pointing out a brick walkway and retaining wall leading to 
the Dining hall that he had built for his Eagle Project in 1920, 
Forty-five years earlier.  To his death a few years ago he treasured the 
memory of making that walkway that thousands upon thousands of Scouts 
used at camp over the course of some 60 summers.

Planning an Eagle project can be a real challenge.  Before any Scout gets 
to far down the path of planning his project, he should carefully read 
BSA's "Life to Eagle Packet" No. 18-927 (1995).  In the "Packet" he will 
find that "Working involving council property or other BSA activities is 
not permitted. The project also may not be peformed for a business, be of 
a commercial nature, or be a fundraiser. (Fundraising is permitted only 
for securing materials or supplies needed to carry out your project.)"

Speaking Only for Myself in the Scouting Spirit, Michael F. Bowman
a/k/a Professor Beaver (WB), ASTA #2566, OA Vigil Honor '71, Eagle
Scout '67, Serving as Deputy District Commissioner for Training,
G.W.Dist., Nat. Capital Area Council, BSA - mfbowman@capaccess.org

Date:         Sat, 3 Aug 1996 00:14:44 -0700
From: Jeff Babis <jbab@THERIVER.COM>
Subject:      Re: Eagle Project

> Anyone have a good eagle project? I need one and could use some others
> for Life Scouts in my troop.

One of the best Eagle projects which I have ever seen was for the
battered children's home.  The Eagle candidate had most of the members
of the troop record on tape while they read children's books from the
library of the children's home.  The tapes were then attached to the
library books with plastic covers.  This project allowed children who
could not read, to listen to the tape while they followed along and
looked at the pictures.  This really helped the overburdened staff of
the children's home.  I believe this project had about 500 boy-hours
in it.

YIS

J. Babis
------------------------------------------------------------
 || Come ride The River ------- http://www.theriver.com/ ||
------------------------------------------------------------

From <@pucc.PRINCETON.EDU:owner-scouts-l@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>  Tue Mar 11 17:06:02 1997
Return-Path: <@pucc.PRINCETON.EDU:owner-scouts-l@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>
Received: from pucc.PRINCETON.EDU (smtpc@pucc.Princeton.EDU [128.112.129.99]) by cap1.CapAccess.org (8.6.12/8.6.10) with SMTP id RAA02819; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 17:06:02 -0500
Received: from PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU by pucc.PRINCETON.EDU (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 6054; Tue, 11 Mar 97 17:01:04 EST
Received: from TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU (NJE origin MAILER@TCUBVM) by PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 3446; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 17:01:04 -0500
Received: from TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@TCUBVM) by
 TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 9133; Tue,
 11 Mar 1997 16:02:15 -0600
Received: from TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU by TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.8b)
          with NJE id 9130 for SCOUTS-L@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU; Tue, 11 Mar 1997
          16:01:30 -0600
Received: from TCUBVM (NJE origin SMTP@TCUBVM) by TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU (LMail
          V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 9129; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 16:01:29 -0600
Received: from ALPHA.IS.TCU.EDU by tcubvm.is.tcu.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with
          TCP; Tue, 11 Mar 97 16:01:24 CST
Received: from mx1.dynasty.net (mx1.dynasty.net) by ALPHA.IS.TCU.EDU (PMDF
          V5.0-5 #20456) id <01IGDRETQD7K0033UI@ALPHA.IS.TCU.EDU> for
          Scouts-L@ALPHA.IS.TCU.EDU; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 15:59:57 -0600 (CST)
Received: from lizard ([199.108.120.43]) by mx1.Dynasty.Net (Netscape Mail
          Server v2.0) with SMTP id AAA333; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 15:59:44 -0600
X-Sender: blkeagle@mail.dynasty.net
MIME-version: 1.0
X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16)
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Message-ID:  <3.0.1.16.19970311225551.2d0fbc1e@mail.dynasty.net>
Date:         Tue, 11 Mar 1997 22:55:51 +0000
Reply-To: "(MAJ) Mike Walton (settummanque,              the blackeagle)" <blkeagle@DYNASTY.NET>
Sender: Scouts-L Youth Group List <Scouts-L@tcu.edu>
From: "(MAJ) Mike Walton (settummanque,              the blackeagle)" <blkeagle@DYNASTY.NET>
Subject:      Re: Eagle Project Question
X-To:         Kellen Daniel Mr WPC/Digital <Daniel.Kellen@WPC.AF.MIL>,
              Scouts-L@tcu.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list SCOUTS-L <SCOUTS-L@TCUBVM.IS.TCU.EDU>
In-Reply-To:  <c=US%a=_%p=DMS%l=WPC-EXCH-NTS0-970311101045Z-2001
 @wpc-exch-nts02.wpc.af.mil>
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Dan Kellen posts from across "town" (Ramstein AB is about 20 kms
or 16 miles from downtown Kaiserslautern):

>As a fairly new SM, I am now faced for the first time with Life Scouts
>looking for an Eagle project.
>
>My quandary is that I don't know what is expected of me.  What level >of
support am I expected to provide in their search for a project?

As much as you need to, Dan....most Life Scouts will have had two
opportunities to see what consittutes an "Eagle project" by their earlier
participation in service projects without being the "guy in charge".
As an Eagle candidate, he should be the one finding, coordinating,
planning, executing and evaluating his own project to benefit the
community in some way.

Give him some "leads" but let HIM decide on which things he can
handle and which are "over his head" to do.  Give him names of
resources that he can utilize, but let HIM call or contact them (and
after you've talked with him and after he'd called or contacted them,
you might want to followup and give some clarity to why he called...)
but let HIM take the lead effort on this...this too, is part of the
project process.

Then, after he has made the initial contact, he should be writing this
up in the Life to Eagle Workbook, and getting the neccessary
approvals, starting with the organization or group that his project will
benefit, then you as his Scoutmaster and then the District's
Advancement Chair...BEFORE he starts out.

>Once they have an idea, who makes the phone calls to determine if the
>effected organizations (beneficiary) will allow/accept/approve that the
>project proceed?

The Eagle candidate should be making all of the intial calls and contacts.
If he needs "emotional" or physical "backup", you may tag - along, but
let HIM make the calls and the contacts and all of the legwork...it
is HIS project and he needs to know that doing this isn't "saying that
I'll help the Thrift Shop this week" , waltzing over to the shop, putting
in 20 hours of work, and that's it.  It requires coordiantion and
permissions, and in many cases as exists in our military communities,
it also requires permits or special memorandums from the community
saying that "this is a good thing and we support it".

Your main job should be to make sure that your Eagle candidnate is
going about it the right, safe and correct way, that those involved know
that he's NOT theere to paint fences or signs but rather to do something
which should be meaningful and needed by the members of the
community, and finally to HELP him to get the neccessary support
if that's what he needs.

But let HIM ask YOU for that help and support, and try not to do
anything until he has done it first!!

Hope that helps....CU at Roundtable!!

Settummanque!

(MAJ) Mike Walton ("no such thing as strong coffee,...")   (502) 827-9201
(settummanque, the blackeagle)    http://www.vhm.com/~uscardnl/
174 Chapelwood Dr., Henderson, KY 42420-5036      kyblkeagle@aol.com
blkeagle@dynasty.net or waltonm%po2.hq@taacom.army.mil
                   ---FORWARD in service to youth ----